Mlm companies reddit. You are looking at a bare minimum of $1000 a year and that wouldn’t include a CRM, web hosting, email, etc. Multi-level marketing (MLM), also called pyramid selling, network marketing, and referral marketing, is a marketing strategy for the sale of products or services where the revenue of the MLM company is derived from a non-salaried workforce selling the company's products/services, while the earnings of the participants are derived from a pyramid The fault lies with the structure of the MLM companies, which funnels the money to the top and leaves the vast majority of people worse off financially. Other. One of my best friends has been direct selling cosmetics and skin care for the past 10 years and currently sells Limelight. He started to push a lot of MLM practices onto the company. To get the money you have to keep trying and also keep buying until you strike. Recruiting took MLMs are legal companies that operate in a borderline ILLEGAL business models. I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Then they tell you of a way to be better. jerrygoins • 1 yr. Biggest/ Fastest growing MLM (s) in Malaysia. Please make sure that you review our sub rules. Downline. You can be a independent broker or an agency but not an MLM. MLMs, or multilevel marketing, is basically the rebrand for pyramid schemes these days. Best Version Media is a total scam. It’s estimated between 73% and 99% of participants either don’t make any money or lose money. •. This is my experience with WFG World Financial Group. You would also need to sell that certain number of homes to stay "active" and retain your license. They make you buy products that are crap. Apparently the entirety of the area’s Young Living reps are headed to a conference in the same city. Reading the hallmarks of a pyramid scheme, my take-away is this: In order to make any real income, you must create a pyramid underneath you. Even if i had 0 clue this was an mlm scam, this makes both you and the company youre repping look super unprofessional. They’re all scams - all of them. The themes were familiar. Anyone have a master list of MLM companies? Without listing a bunch of boring details, I fear my mother is very close to getting sucked into some kind of MLM scam. I don't think it's technically an MLM, but they are still shady as shit. -Family First Life has optional access to warm leads that can be purchased from various lead been applying on LinkedIn and Indeed to get a marketing gig however, I am getting fast responses from pretty sketchy companies, there’s WAYYY too many of them. In June 2000, Parliament approved an amendment to the Act to widen the definition of pyramid selling to catch all business schemes that were multi-level in nature. If you were in an MLM, they would need you to sell a certain number of homes to stay active to earn commissions on your downline. You start off when your friend or family members starts critiquing your life choices. Operational Resemblance: Eaconomy's affiliate marketing structure is a pyramid scheme. After reading through the post, I quickly realized that the company described in These companies are super predatory and shouldn't be allowed to operate. You make no money off that. r/antiMLM: Multi Level Marketing (MLM) schemes are a drain on our society. Yes, search for distributors. They each have their own rules for selling their product. A few members tried to recruit me and it was so cringeworthy. I only use them for special occasions or when I have to see my relatives just to piss them off (long story but basically they hate me because they think I “married into money” based on our ability to buy a home; I will have to elaborate later but one is a HUGE MLM supporter) Anyway they are okay; not something I would wear regularly and you have to be a Globe Life is the parent company of 'American Income Life Insurance'. [deleted] • 1 yr. Find the best posts and communities about MLM on Reddit. TheRealAlanTuring. Let's be clear about one thing right away: MLMs definitely ARE pyramid schemes, there's no doubt about that. Even Bill Ackerman (Wall Street Billionaire) lost millions of dollars betting A lot of them operate under a DBA name to distance themselves from the MLM’s crappy reputation while still actually using the MLM business model. Excessive zinc intake can lead to copper deficiency, neurological issues, and gastrointestinal symptoms. To avoid getting scammed by MLMs — which eventually collapse anyway — skip the Maggiemaccy. ItWorks - they’re so aggressive lately! I receive more random messages for this than any other MLM Younique - I’m tired of the gross selfies showing off their makeup skillz. One_Big2047. She isn’t putting on a facade. The more money you invest, the more "discount" they give you. In fact, the majority said they were "like sisters". She is clearly doing very very very well. This is 100% a scam and a pyramid scheme. And MLMs operate in a curiously triangular manner. We are very thankful to the popular Facebook group “Sounds Like MLM But OK” for the effort and time they put into starting off this huge master list, and sharing it with us, as the basis of our master list. 00 a year profit. Search up the company before you apply, and check in with r/DevilCorp if you have any suspicions. How I almost joined Amway - a warning against joining MLM companies. ADMIN MOD. Thank you for your post. This is when the company shifted out of white coat and into mlm. : r/sales. There are several essential oil companies that do not have ties to an MLM. May 23, 2022 · In 2021, the FTC warned 1,100 companies against making misleading money-making and earnings claims, of which 700 were MLM companies. Literally any non-MLM insurance company will be better, because you’ll actually be paid a wage and won’t have to pay them The CEO and founder of Qyral, the “Ozempic” MLM, has been removed for “alleged fiduciary breaches”! Currently on a flight. I had just started working a new job at Pinnacle Marketing Solutions, I had been hired quickly and had worked three 9 hour shifts. Always do your research on the company before you commit to an interview. Recently, she sent me this video of Limelight's president talking about the company and direct selling. The original Multi-Level Marketing and Pyramid Selling (Prohibition) Act was first passed in 1973. The distributors call it The Wellness Company. There is little to no market for most of the awful crap that gets sold via MLM. Please list any MLM companies so we have a thread to rely on. I see people use "pyramid scheme" to describe MLMs all of the time in screenshots of conversations with victims of MLMs. Pretty good at hiding it. Please do not work there, you won’t be able to sleep well at night knowing you’re screwing over many MANY hardworking business ownersStay far away, these people are snakes. NEVER get involved with any insurance "opportunity" that wants you to put money ITAP of my son exploring the forest [MLM] 8. Yes. ago. Edit: honestly if any company refuse to offer you a position they are probably not a MLM. Again - if you think your roof needs to be repaired, then you should initiate the contact. Yes, most. MLM products aren’t always bad for customers, but the model always hurts sellers. I said "oh this is one of those mlm scams. PRIMERICA really is a scam . -Agents are paid directly from the carriers that they're appointed with, not Family First Life. The company is a life insurance company not a marketing organization. It has thus been a great opportunity for me with my marketing background and drive to succeed. The retired husband. Yes, it is an MLM, yes it is a scam in the way that the products are vitamins and stimulants not a magical lifestyle change. To judge a person who’s done it in the past is a little odd to me. They typically focus on whole life policies. *unless she purchased Thrive Causmetics, aka makeup. Yes, you made a lot of sense. Term life insurance is totally completely different than whole life insurance. This program is worth not more than $1K in my opinion. But if you work on it you, can quit your 9-5 job probably the longest 3-5 years and make 20k-50k a month. Many of our “friends” under her also have reached high levels. You can earn through compensations and commissions, but that takes a load of effort instead of working by the hour. Its participants either build the pyramid taller or get squashed by it. Yeah it’s not a scam technically. FalineK. At the hangout he told me about an amazing job/financial opportunity and asked me to come to the next meeting with him. Why Eaconomy Scam. the first person to get sucked in will help suck their partner in, 2. And then the host of the info session dropped the name “Amway”, and I immediately dipped out like “oh yeah this is totally a scam”. Sure they bought an MLB stadium but I'd be a billionaire corporation too if I barely paid my employees and sold From Wikipedia: Multi-level marketing (MLM), also called pyramid selling, network marketing, and referral marketing, is a marketing strategy for the sale of products or services where the revenue of the MLM company is derived from a non-salaried workforce selling the company's products/services, while the earnings of the participants are SCAM JOBS CHICAGO Pinnacle Marketing. It’s quite possibly the MLM-est MLM actually. AIL is an MLM. I don't see that friend the same way anymore. Success rates are minuscule. They provide term life insurance and whole life policies insurance. I’m tired of being added to their “beauty” groups on FB automatically. These were roofing companies I would not even call for a quote. They sell products too, but their hiring tactics and buy-in requirements are like MLM. Happy job hunting! Beware of MLM structured companies (warning) Upline (IMO/FMO) So this was originally a response to a comment on this sub, but I see a ton of new people coming into insurance, (speaking to independent guys here) and there are many many hungry wolves waiting to recruit these naïve noobs and make a profit. Sort by: AutoModerator. 465 Online. If the company you signed up with is an MLM, you won’t make any profit. ago • Edited 1 yr. 827K Members. Some background on American Income Life: they are partnered with members of credit unions, labor unions, associations, and private policyholders. Multi-level marketing (MLM), also called network marketing or pyramid selling, is a controversial marketing strategy for the sale of products or services in which the revenue of the MLM company is derived from a non-salaried workforce selling the company's products or services, while the earnings of the participants are derived from a pyramid-shaped or binary compensation commission system. " Sure, jan. Hello. I’ve been in one before that was great and there was help 24/7. I’m sorry, but over 99% of people in MLMs lose money. Agents and managers work as independent contractors (so a 1099 is issued as opposed to COMPANIES TO LOOK OUT FOR: Arrow & Atlas, Chicago Connect, Blank Space Branding, Prestige International Chicago, Chicago Marketing Inc, Sunwire Group, Lost Chicago, B&G Advertising, Seven Cities, Plumtree Group, Senior associates desperate to be promoted and make equity partner (in MLM firms, they call it "levelling up" Intern taking unpaid jobs at these firms (a lot of unpaid internships offered by MLM companies too) Toxic culture (yelling and screaming by some crazy partners) Extroverts thrive in law firms. Yes, that can happen. Might not be a MLM, however when we were replacing a roof, I had a list of people who knocked and woke the baby/pissed the dogs off/interrupted my reading, etc. Genuine question. Without fail, all claimed to be extremely close. That being said, there are MLMs in the insurance world. Tread carefully within the job market. If you suspect it is an MLM it’s better to look for legitimate insurance companies in your area and not even pursue Yes, that's a scam. In 2022, the FTC issued a first-ever ANPR focused specifically The Mortgage Industry is Turning MLM. The Mansion. mnqret. A couple of years ago, when I was an undergrad, I worked retail on the side. People: Eaconomy's founders, Hassan Mahmoud and Candace Ross Mahmoud, were involved in SilverStar Live forex trading scheme. Frothmourne. annslisaemily. Term life insurance is not an investment it is a payout if you die. This has been a thing for a while with certain real estate brokerages, but now some mortgage companies are trying the business model. So I personally got dragged into an multi-level marketing (MLM) recruitment meeting recently. This commission — yours, your upline's cut, your upline's upline's cut, and so on — is built into the By Manipulating the entire model, MLM companies merged to direct selling. I have a set of magnetic lashes. If you’re a Loan Officer you can “sponsor” others to join the company, and then you’ll get paid on all of their closed loans. They deliberately target couples for two reasons: 1. EDIT: In case you genuinely don’t know anything about Amway, I want to provide more info so you understand why it’s a scam, and why you should stay away. TITLE # of active packages Monthly Bonus PLATINUM 300 $1,750 1 STAR PLATINUM 500 $2,500 2 STAR PLATINUM 1,500 $5,000 3 STAR PLATINUM 3,000 Oct 4, 2019 · In fact, these businesses rely heavily on recruiting new members, who are mostly women, targeting stay-at-home moms, military wives and others under the guise of financial empowerment. 6. So I’m wondering, what are the few big or fastest Sep 24, 2020 · 2. MLM is actually illegal in Malaysia, but as long as the company have a physical product to sell and not just earning for membership fee then AFAIK they are not breaking any laws, no matter how stupid or ridiculous the product is). Most people lose money because they cant sell the stock they take up. If the person pitching you a product also encourages you to join the company as a consultant, it’s because they stand to earn a portion of your sales. Because if someone brings somebody on board to sell said product, they have potential earnings from those sales in some of those cases. Then if you run out of money and no longer able to upkeep the finances to buy MLM stuff or join seminars, your game is up. Over time, the company grew and came out with a vast number of products. I will start from the beginning. They get a kickback from every time the deal goes through, and the roofing company gets some business. Because that is how my sister reasons her decision to join the MLM company that she is a part of. I don't know about any of you, but Same logic goes for MLM, jackpot look suisui nice nice and mouth watering. Melaleuca is an MLM. An MLM is defined by having a downline where you get a cut of the money your recruits make and your recruit’s recruits. Sometimes 3 or 4 levels deep, you get a cut. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or A simple google shows that NWM is one of the largest insurance company in the US. The Mercedes. Sep 27, 2021 · In 2019, supplement MLM company AdvoCare agreed to pay $150 million to settle charges from the FTC that it had operated as an illegal pyramid scheme. It seems like a lot of people on here forget that it’s not the people that are bad it’s the MLM itself. It’s a really old marketing tactic that is currently used by less reputable companies. One of these was Cassie Rosenberg, a fellow Thrive promoter who was planning on I worked for a non profit and I was making 15$/hour. A college friend who lives in Houston got into Arbonne maybe around 2007-09. Later on, the company came out with their CBD line in like October of 2018. The False Sisterhood of MLM Companies. Imo there are two reasons MLMs pull in so many unaware victims - one is that Americans are not well trained in logical thinking nor in the use of accurate math. • 2 yr. 5. Then you find yourself in a conference room on a weekday night sitting through a pitch session by the ALS company. Stay away. MLMs never offer a standard job contract, because their business model cant afford a proper hire. Not really a horror story by comparison but I just really feel for this young woman that has been so badly sucked into Juice Plus. r/itookapicture. They laughed at me when I said my previous (had to move forcefully due to being kicked out from our inlaws) job paid me 19 and that it was a waste. It's practitioner-based organization. LiveGood is a company that specializes in offering health products to its members. SpecificMongoose. . You get to pay a higher insurance premium or, worst case, your insurance will cancel you. They are lying about the role and i’m seeing reviews online saying it is commission based direct sales. From Wikipedia: Multi-level marketing (MLM), also called pyramid selling, network marketing, and referral marketing, is a marketing strategy for the sale of products or services where the revenue of the MLM company is derived from a non-salaried workforce selling the company's products/services, while the earnings of the participants are I also noticed several other companies on Indeed with the same stench. There is education in real estate. IT DOES NOT MATTER WHAT SHAPE THE COMPANY STRUCTURE TAKES! Iron overload can lead to hemochromatosis, a condition that may cause liver disease, heart problems, and other serious issues. The rep across the aisle from me has already been ripping out oils to sell his seatmate. The recruiter may receive a cut of That's very true is not a get rich quick. So many get into them out of desperation and because of the promises they’re offered and truly have no idea how bad they are. Amway is literally a cult in MLM clothing. They do have an actual product, but the money is in recruiting to your downline. Is there a list of MLM companies I can send her so she can clearly see who to avoid? Stop MLM schemes from draining your friends dry. Yep. Transamerica has an MLM leg, WFG. How are MLM companies like Herbalife so profitable? Genuine question. There is no actual education in an MLM. These companies like Gya Labs are generally much better because they don't have to give their product away at cost, nor do they have to sell their product in order to make just money without quality control in there products. 1K 255. RUN! Transamerica is not an MLM itself, but it's the parent company of WFG, and their broker-dealer is Transamerica Financial Advisors. Not an MLM. Those are definitely mlms. MLM is not a scam, its just a method of selling stuff. Any real estate or insurance sales, in your mind is a pyramid scheme/MLM. AlmightyxOne • 1 yr. The usual money you make in MLMs is so little, like 300. MLM in itself is not a scam although it’s very similar to a pyramid scheme. They operate like a cult. ITAP of a happy woman [MLM] 7. It’s a bait and switch technique and sadly common in the insurance industry. I found this sub after stumbling across a post about MLM marketing scams going on in Chicago. Boyleforpresident. I’m looking for new ICs and probably have at least 20+ agency owner friends in the same position. It was a company that sold everyday products, like toothpaste, toilet paper, etc. Rather than selling their own products, they sell products and services of "Fortune 500" companies, such as Verizon, AT&T, Assurance Wireless, non-profit organizations, etc. Scam! First and foremost no true employer would charge you for background check. The program is approximately 12 weeks long and it is significantly overpriced (in my opinion), the program is approximately $4K and includes workbooks, live group coaching calls, hypnosis recordings, private FaceBook group, and video playbacks. Neofrey. Lol good ol cutco. This is a business model that only earns money for the people at the top who are MLM Pyramid schemes collapse from the bottom up, take far longer to happen and have the potential to reach a steady state after a significant majority of the pyramid drops out. Amway is just a garbage MLM company that relies on recruiting new members for any sort of significant revenue. They hired doctors to make their products as great as possible. if either partner starts doubting, the other will reinforce the brainwashing to keep them in. Finance. The Ministry of Trade and Industry administers the Act. The issue with Primerica is the high overhead of MLM destroys the value of the policy, since the distribution costs are so high. MLMs have employees to pay, as well as other expenses, just like any other company. In addition to providing its members with access to high-quality products, LiveGood also offers From Wikipedia: Multi-level marketing (MLM), also called pyramid selling, network marketing, and referral marketing, is a marketing strategy for the sale of products or services where the revenue of the MLM company is derived from a non-salaried workforce selling the company's products/services, while the earnings of the participants are I just want to understand if those companies are just scamming people with crap or if there are companies who actually produce something good or okay and believe that MLM is the only way they can sell it. Senior Life is not MLM , it has the typical hierarchy of all insurance companies. Monyet-monyet sekalian, I’ve constantly hearing about Usana being one of the fastest growing MLM companies in Malaysia while traditional big guys like Amway, Cosway, etc are not growing as fast as the market (or at all). Help me remember an MLM from the early to mid-2000’s. similar, I guess, to Amway but not as large. However, the collapse is of the same mechanism, "cash starvation" due to a lack of dupes and a collapse of exponential growth. Feb 22, 2018 · The MLM Master List intends to provide a reference for the names of all known past and present MLM schemes (and some direct selling schemes, where applicable). If your post breaks any of the rules then your post will be removed. The second reason is the way wealth & wealthy people are practically worshipped in America. You'll get help to get licensed and appointed to the carriers. I helped start a solar company in SoCal and after not hiring from the outside and promoting from within the company for 3 years, the other partners brought in a top earner from cutco. High school friend invited me to a hangout. Omg I'm gonna burst. MLM company with products to sell is call Direct Sale. One busyish day, as I was ringing up a guy for his purchase, he asked me Most new agents start out at 100% comp. Livegood is a so-called product-based pyramid. Story. CellCore Biosciences is not an MLM Company. • 9 mo. It operates as a buyers club, which means that members pay a fee to join and gain access to exclusive deals on a variety of health products. So I told my coworker, “thanks but no thanks, no hard feelings” and that was that. K" is one of these doctors. This includes bonuses, trip incentives and in the event of chargebacks, will settle up with the carrier directly. Full disclosure; I went not knowing it was one at the invitation of a friend, and by the time it was too late, I ended up listening to the whole brainwashing session. If you want a w2 job maybe try AAA or something similar. A simple Google search should be enough to let you know if it's an MLM--if you have to question whether it is or not, it probably is. They are not MLM related. Any commission you get will be eaten up by expenses. Economy & Finance. " I blocked both of them when patricia said "lol not a mlm scam. Consultants receive an additional 20,000 shares at the Platinum Consultant level. These companies are growing fast and new MLM financial services companies are popping up. LiveGood Products for MLM. Note: You must qualify for three consecutive months without defaulting or losing status of the rank before receiving shares. So, yes, by antiMLM logic, EXP Realty is an MLM. She’s 20, a young single Mum, just lost her Dad to suicide and the father of her child is a deadbeat that left her to pursue his career as a professional DJ. Be aware of "entry level marketing positions" where they claim to have impressive pay, but absolutely zero benefits. The hard sell is in recruiting, so you can make money. She makes claims that direct selling is going to replace the traditional Multi Level Marketing (MLM) schemes are a drain on our society. But one nontheless. But it involves you going out there and recruiting other members who offer financial services to Sep 2, 2019 · On r/antiMLM, Reddit users warn others of the toxic MLM "hustle" and mock the "huns" who get sucked into it. • 6 yr. The model of MLM I was involved in was very atypical; they had an office, daily meetings of the salespeople, and all the other trappings that made the "business" seem more legitimate including an interview process that fooled me into lowering my guard. Multi Level Marketing (MLM) schemes are a drain on our society. Posted this to tifu, got removed because nothing significantly bad happened, so I'll put it here. Best to get your products elsewhere, as MLM is by far the costliest (to the customer Red79Hibiscus. Oct 9, 2020 · The person who recruits a distributor to an MLM. In an MLM, a sponsor's downline is made up of his recruits who sell products to their own networks. Anyone heard of WFG, World Financial Group? My cousin has been trying to get me to join this company called WFG and he said it is an excellent way to make passive income, he claims he makes 5-6k/month sitting from home. Word-of-mouth works in direct selling, which means Marketing through people. MLM want as many people as they can get and they will never refuse a down line. After doing some research on the internet I've realized that primerica is just a fucking scam. In the days following what was first a disappearance, many of those closest to Shanann were interviewed by law enforcement. Yes it’s an MLM. So, your pressure is not just to recruit but to keep your recruits buying from you as well. Lots of agencies that are not MLMs are looking for IC travel agents. Could be a new division of Primerica or American income life. AsylumJim. From the sound of that it’s IM academy. The product went to a man, and now he is selling that product to his friends and family. Not exactly MLM but Advanced Living Series (ALS) works on a similar MLM model. Anyone you recruit, you do not make money off the application fee in which you also paid to get started just like they are doing. The thrive dietary supplements are all MLM though. By comparison, all direct sales companies are more legitimate then MLM scams. By the logic in this group, every insurance company should be on the "list". MLM is not always a scam, but illegal pyramid schemes are often dressed up as MLM plans. . Hopefully an ex-primerica/WFG mlmer can provide us with their MINIMUM 401K monthly management fee (I'm guessing it's $50-$100 monthly). Direct selling means companies bring their products to the people through distributors and marketing. It’s a downline. STOP calling MLMs pyramid schemes (I promise this post is anti MLM) Help/Advice. • 4 yr. MLM's in Malaysia. Looks like it's part of 'The Devil Corp' which is essentially an MLM that works with different clients. What is sad is that the agents are trained to sell products that are over priced under performing, 80% of there training consists of recruiting and the other 20% on how to sell there over priced products, they are not well trained at all. TEXLCKBUSTER • 1 yr. I'm a pessimist when it comes to human intelligence in relation to consumption habits, but come-on, how DUMB do people have to be to fall for companies like Herbalife. But the insurance is real, and is underwritten by National Benefit Life Insurance company. 2. Another girl a went to high school with uses her ten yr old daughter to shill monat. You can also look up ‘The Finance Guy’ site, where they look at individual MLM companies and work out exactly how much it’s possible to make in them. It's a scam, just like the "car warranty" robo calls we all get. So, I figured I could make a post using Whether or not something is a pyramid scheme is a major point of contention between Huns and the anti-MLM army, as we all know. 9K 145. He was also a senior editor or WebMd. I’ll start Let's talk about MLM Cosmetics Companies. KuramaReinara. • 3 yr. It's bad right now, especially because of covid but keep searching! Also, the makeup company is called makeover essentials and the car products are FW1 car wax (owned by parent company devil corp). Thrive scares the hell out of me TBH and I wouldn't let it anywhere near my skin. Disputes: Key figures like Sal Leto (linked to multiple scams) left Eaconomy under accusations of stolen assets. tigiPaz • 1 yr. Primerica sells overpriced insurance. I got offered $18/hr at a non-profit and had to fight to get to $21/hr. The owners of the company are notorious in the profession. PRIMERICA IS SCARY AND A SCAM. Why aren't MLM companies illegal? Fundamentally, most MLM companies work by making you buy product up-front to then resell at a profit, but the rub is that the market is saturated and you won't find people willing to pay a price high enough to earn a profit. Companies such as Avon operate as an MLM. I hope that they have gone out of businessjust don’t remember the name. Yes, they are all bad -- because there are always people who can't afford to do so being encouraged to "invest" their money into what will ultimately be nothing but a big financial loss for them. "Dr. 4. But a totally stupid and useless method for the agents to make money with almost certainty of failure and losing money. Long story short I sold my share and moved on haha If you join PHP Agency, you're paying $199 to have their platform in order to conduct business. And WFG people sometimes use TFA as the name since that's where they're registered. Court lawsuits, scammed people, pyramid, ponzi. In MLM, the product that you are selling is irrelevant - the real product is to sell marketing kits to more suckers. It’s actually not a scam but it depends heavily on the group you join. Doterra - love oils. Second the license to sell insurance is $200, which either the employer would reimburse you or pay for you. It has a pyramid structure: Pyramid schemes may be illegal, but that doesn’t mean they don’t exist. Sounds like she’s part of that “World Financial Group”. GToken, they have a marketing arm that has a pyramid-style cash flow between recruits, but each person is limited to only a few layers of recruitment. They have their own products and underwriting. However, in addition to those expenses, they have to give enough of a commission to the MLM pyramid to make the consultants feel like they're making money. Thanks but no thanks. ap tl za xf jz zy bn oy hw dk